6/9/12 Report - Odyssey Marine, Gold & Emeralds, Tsunami Debris & More

Written by the TreasureGuide for the exclusive use of treasurebeachesreport.blogspot.com.

Photo from Manor Auctions Web Site



Here is another item from a South Florida estate sold by Manor Auctions.  Read the bit about the auction on the following web site.

Here is the web site to see more.

http://manorauctions.com/auction-news/news/gold-shipwreck-treasure-coin-collection-heads-to-auction



Here is an excellent detailed article on Odyssey Marine from Bloomberg Businessweek.  It gives a lot of information on the return of coins to Spain as well as the their other ventures.

http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2012-06-07/odyssey-and-the-lost-spanish-treasure#p1

Thanks to John L. for submitting this link.

The US West Coast is preparing to be hit by tons of floating tsunami debris.

http://xfinity.comcast.net/articles/news-national/20120608/US.Tsunami.Debris/?cid=hero_media

There should be some salvageable items in all that debris.

The Federal government is counting jobs connected to antique stores and consignment stores as green jobs when they count the number of green jobs they created.   If you remember, a number of weeks ago I said that detecting is a green activity.   Maybe you thought that was a real stretch.  The idea is the same.  Old items that are salvaged and put back into use saves materials and energy.   I always wish I knew how many coins were returned to circulation by detectorists.  And how much silver and gold has been recovered by detectorists. 

I think you would actually have to get into a more detailed analysis, but hey, it's the same logic the Federal government is using so there must be something wrong with it.

 

Typical Treasure Coast Beach - Sandy

Not much change in conditions again.  Still around two foot seas.  Still sandy conditions.

The wind is out of the south. 

Yesterday there were some decent surfing waves at a few spots.  Where the waves will break depends partly upon the shape of the bottom.

And as I mentioned yesterday, even though conditions are generally poor, there is always somewhere to hunt and something to find.  When the sand is building one place it is coming from someplace else.  Look for the places the sand is leaving.  The poorer conditions are, the harder it is to find those better spots. 

I'll explore more treasure coin data in the next few posts.

I never know which posts my readers like or don't like so much.  I wish I had a better way of knowing that other than simply hit count.


Happy hunting,
TreasureGuide@comcast.net

6/8/12 Report - Silver Coins in the Florida State Collection & More

Written by the TreasureGuide for the exclusive use of treasurebeachesreport.blogspot.com.



Can You Believe This Stuff?



The item shown to the right is from an October 2011 auction by Manor Auctions.  It has nothing to do with the Florida Collection that I'll discuss below.  Other similarly big gaudy items were also in the auction.

Here is the link if you want to see more of this item and other similar items.

http://manorauctions.com/auction-news/news/gold-shipwreck-treasure-coin-collection-heads-to-auction



I’ve seen a lot of misinformation circulating in the treasure community about the treasure coins in the Florida Collection. As you probably know, Florida collects a portion of the finds from the leased shipwrecks salvaged in Florida waters. The collection of silver cobs and treasure coins, as of the first comprehensive inventory in 1997, included over 23,000 silver coins, most coming from the 1715 Fleet.

This information is provided by James Miller, in the foreword to Alan Craig’s book Spanish Colonial Silver Coins in the Florida Collection, 2000. At the time Miller was the Chief of Archaeological Research for the State of Florida,

Earlier, Craig conducted an inventory and wrote a book on the gold coins of the collection.

It doesn’t seem to me that a taxpayer of the State should have to purchase an expensive book to learn about the state collection, but that seems to be the case. I’ve not seen how you can get access to information on the State Collection otherwise. Isn’t the collection gathered and maintained for the people of the State? Has anyone seen it? Maybe I just don’t know how to gain access to the database, and maybe it is possible to simply walk in and look at the collection. I don’t know. I’ve done a few Google searches, but haven’t found out how to access the State‘s database at this point. If you have seen the collection or if you know how to access the database or detailed information on the database, please let me know. The taxpayers pay to maintain the collection and should get some value out of it.

I wanted to give you some information on the silver coins of the Florida Collection today. Remember that this information is over ten years old at this point and presumably more coins have been added to the collection since the book was written.  I understand, though, that coins are not routinely selected in mass for addition to the collection these days unless they are somewhat unique and provide some additional numismatic information Unlike the early days when bags of coins were accepted by the pound, now the State is more particular in their selection of coins and artifacts.

Of the total of the 22,938 silver coins in the collection when Craig's inventory was conducted, by far the greatest number, 13,433, came from the Douglass Beach wreck. The second greatest number, 8637, came from undetermined wrecks. ( It seems to me that can mean a lot of different things. ) The third greatest number came from the Cabin Wreck, 199. And then the Jupiter Wreck, 198.

I am almost certain that the ranking has changed in recent years, and the Jupiter Wreck has been one of the largest contributers in more recent years.

The overly large proportion of coins coming from the Douglass Beach Wreck is surprising to me.

The book states that the easiest finds have already been made and the number of coins found in more recent years had decreased.

So does that mean that the large number of coins already found on the Douglass Wreck indicate that that wreck has been worked out to a greater extent than the other wrecks? That is what the book seems to suggest to me.

The greatest number of coins in the collection is the large denomination cobs. Of the coins in the collection at the time, 11,779 were identified as being 8 Reales, 5,366 4 Reales, 1,099 2 Reales, 2,573 1 Reales, and 1,161 halves. With the exception of 2 Reales, as the denomination decreases, so does the number found, or should I say, the number in the collection decreases.

It makes sense to believe that larger denomination coins were the most convenient for shipping large amounts of silver. Craig suggests that smaller denomination coins were kept for daily use in the New World rather than being shipped back to Spain.

Could it also be that smaller coins are not as easy to detect/find? Certainly that is true, but I don’t know how large that effect would be on the overall number of coins added to the State Collection. Maybe insignificant, maybe not.

I do know that a lot of detectorists were missing the small denomination coins on the beach back in the eighties. I have questioned the relationship of beach found coins of different denominations compared to sea-salvaged coins before.  I have also collected a little data on that in addition to my personal experience, which suggests a higher percentage of small denomination coins found on the beach as opposed to those salvaged from the sea.

I'll talk more about the coins in the Florida Collection again sometime soon.


The waves were higher this morning than predicted and expected.  There were actually a number of surfers out.  Nonetheless, beach detecting conditions remain basically unchanged.  The water was just a little rougher.

In the past, I used to frequently remind that my beach detecting conditions rating  goes from 1 to 5, with 1 indicating poor conditions and 5 excellent detecting conditions and that I start the scale with a 1 rather than a zero because even when conditions are poor there is still some chance of a cob popping up, no matter how slim.  I bring that up because even now there are a few scarce cuts and a few cobs and artifacts being found.
Sometimes you have to check a lot of beaches to find one good spot.  That is the case now.

Happy hunting,
TreasureGuide@comcast.net

6/7/12 Report - Concrete Floats, Drowned Plane & Club Hunt

Written by the TreasureGuide for the exclusive use of treasurebeachesreport.blogspot.com.



Concrete Dock Floats From Japan to Oregon!



This is an AP story that is widely circulating today.  It appears that this 66 foot concrete dock from Japan washed up on a beach in Oregon.  No one knows for sure, but it seems that it washed over from Japan as a result of the tsunami.

As you know, I am always interested in how things are moved by waves and currents and how things end up on a beach.  This case illustrates something that I've talked about a few times.  Weight is not the primary factor.  This dock is certainly heavier than most objects, but not heavier than an ocean liner.

The story states that this dock is supposed to float.  That makes the story less remarkable, but no less illustrative.  I presume that it is hollow.  Instead of one large hollow area inside, I suppose they could have made it very porous, containing many smaller hollow areas.

Anyhow, here is the link to the story.

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/sideshow/66-foot-concrete-dock-washes-ashore-oregon-may-185118645.html

You might remember a recent post about a WWII plane found in deep water off the coast of Jupiter.  According to the May 24, 2012 post in the following referenced naval history blog  the Naval History and Heritage Command’s Underwater Archaeology Branch, the U.S. Navy’s Military Sealift Command and the U.S. Navy Mobile Diving and Salvage Unit TWO has recently been on site to identify the plane and to map and document the wreck.

Here is the link for more details and pictures.  There are more recent posts in that blog, so you'll want to scroll down to find this story.

http://www.navalhistory.org/

As is often the case, a local fellow made the original find and then contacted the navy.  He isn't named in the blog but is referred to as a local dive charter operator.  It seems to me he deserves to be credited, but maybe it was his choice to not be named.


The St. Lucie Metal Detecting Club is about one year old now.  Can you believe it?

I received an email from Bernie (founder of the club) which says the following.

Our next club meeting will be at 6:00pm July 14th 2012.

The meeting will be held at my house. Bring Your Favorite Beverage. I think we'll order out again, it seemed to work well at the last meeting. Maybe we'll do wings or subs this time.

Our June hunt is scheduled for Saturday June 23rd. We will be doing some hunting at the St Lucie Inlet Beach, we will meet at Bathtub Reef in Stuart and park our cars there. It's about a 2 mile walk to the inlet. Be sure to bring plenty to drink, sunscreen & bug repellent. Who ever doesn't make the long walk can search the Bathtub Beach area there's always some recent drops in that area. Be sure to get there early to get a parking space...

Thanks for all of your efforts Benie. 

For more information contact Bernie at twiprod001@att.net.

The wind is from the south and the seas around one to two feet.  This weekend the seas will be even more calm.   So beach conditions haven't changed lately and probably won't for some time.

It is hot and humid out there. Be prepared for occasional showers. 

Happy hunting,
treasureguide@comcast.net

6/6/12 Report - Clues to OMD Lead Seal Found & More



Written by the TreasureGuide for the exclusive use of treasurebeachesreport.blogspot.com.




Back in my 3/11/12 report, I posted a photo of what appeared to be a lead seal bearing the letters OMD, which was submitted by one of this blog's readers for help with identification.   It appears that a very similar looking item, identified as being from an early 17th century shipwreck, is shown in this picture which was sent to the detectorist.  Both the lead seal and the olive jar rim find, which I showed not long ago, appear to be from the same early 17th century shipwreck. 

[Above Referenced Picture Removed.  I just found out the photo was from a copyrighted source and even though it was not used here for any commerical purpose, removed it as quickly as possible.]

I really like the problem-solving process and how all the clues slowly come together to provide a picture of when and how an item was lost.  I appreciate that much more than the economic value of an item, which doesn't mean much to me.

One common misconception about detectorists is that they do it for the profit.  There are some that do, just like archaeologists want to be paid for their work, but many detectorists never sell a single thing that they find.  They are more interested in the history of the item and conduct a lot of research to get to know more about their finds.  I would say that is especially true of the guys that are really dedicated and have been in the hobby for a long time, as opposed to newer hobbyists who are always asking "what's it worth."  Of course, asking how much something is worth doesn't mean that they are going to sell the item, but  how much an item is worth is to them a crude measure of the item's interest-value (or how good of a find it is).  It provides an external reference for those who haven't through their personal experiences yet developed a well-defined internal value scale of their own.

My favorite story of all that has ever appeared in this blog, is the story of Ian's coaked sheave.  The thing I liked so much about that story is the excellent research that Ian did, and how the story slowly came together from various clues and resources. 

You can see a photo of Ian's coaked sheave by going back to my 1/21/2010 post. 

By the way, a quick way to find topics from old posts is to use this blog's search box.  People don't use the search box enough.  Try it out.

I found a listing of archaeology blogs the other day.  You might find it handy.

Here is the link.      http://www.thebestcolleges.org/top-archaeology-blogs/

After finding this list,  I took a look at the first post in the first blog on the list.  And wouldn't you know - that post was about what appears to me to be the primary preoccupation of modern archaeology - looters.  Well, not really.  It was about Ric Savage and the American Diggers TV show. 

Don't get me wrong.  I'm not for looting.  But I am against characterizing anybody who digs up any object anywhere anytime as a looter or just as bad as one.  If these archaeologists would get busy on real projects, they would have something to do besides watching TV programs by ex-wrestlers and bashing everybody who finds something in the dirt.

Before proceeding, let me also say that I am not a big fan of either American Diggers or Ric Savage.  But neither am I a fan of mischaracterization.  And I certainly don't believe that every object that has ever been dropped should instantly become the property of academic archaeology or the government.

The blog of which I speak, seemed to blurr the distinction between artifacts capable of providing new insights into ancient cultures with anything and everything that has ever been lost.  I don't know if the failure to make that distinction is the result of dishonesty or simply fuzzy thinking.  Since I have to believe that archaeologists are capable of making the distinction between archaeologically significant finds and the billions of tons of miscellaneous junk that litters the landscapes of the world, I tend to take it as dishonest attempt by archaeologists to claim the world and everything in it as "their" domain - everybody else being an ignorant intruder.

I could go on and on about this, but I'll stop there.

Did you know that there are tens of thousands of treasure coins in the Florida collection?  Mostly coming from the efforts of treasure hunters?   Do you think that it is the proper business of the state to maintain such collections?  At tax-payer expense?   Have you seen any of those coins?   What benefit have you derived from the collection?  Just a few questions.  Maybe I'll do a poll on that sometime.

By the way, I posted a new poll in this blog recently.  Your response will help provide meaningful information.

Tomorrow I'll have more on the Helldiver found in the ocean off of Jupiter.


There was a little rain this morning cooling things off.   The seas remain calm.   In the next few days the seas will be increasing a little, but only up to about two or three feet, so that won't change detecting conditions significantly.


Happy hunting,
TreasureGuide@comcast.net

6/4/12 Report - Gucci Watch, Indian Head & Unidentified Shipwreck



Wrttitten by the TreasureGuide for the exclusive use of treasurebeachesreport.blogspot.com.




Gucci Watch Found

The wind is from the west this morning and the seas are still flat.  It is beautiful weather for water hunting except for the sandy shallow-water conditions.  While there isn't much chance of finding old things, people are still losing things everyday. 

The few dips there are in front of the beaches mostly have a layer of shells on top.  Those shelly shallow water dips aren't much good, but they do collect watches.

The poor economic conditions in Europe are causing an increase in the price of gold and silver again.  Gold recently went back up over $1600 per ounce.  Of course, the dollar has been doing well too lately because it is not as bad as some of the other currencies.

To the right is one watch find.  In my experience, it seems that Gucci watches are unusually common finds. 

I don't know why they are lost so often, but I suspect it is because of the type of catch that is used and the rigid band. 

The Gucci watches with the changeable color face bands are very common finds, as are dive watches.  

I can understand how people lose watches in the water, but you would think those lost on land would be found before a detectorist comes along.  It isn't like a small gold ring that would quickly become buried in the sand.

Even when conditions are poor on the beaches, it is possible to make a few old finds.  One way is to look for places where sand or earth is being moved, as I mentioned yesterday. 

Here is a beat up Indian Head penny.  It doesn't look like it circulated much, but it got mangled somehow.  The other side is really nice.

1905 Penny

An unidentified 19th century shipwreck was recently discovered in the Gulf of Mexico during a NOAA expedition.   The following web site tells more and shows some really nice underwater photos of the wreck, including the remains of a lot of the copper hull sheathing that shows the shape of the bow even though most of the wooden structure is gone.

Notice all of the nails, and the remains of the lead Roman Numerals.   Also a lot of bottles, dishes, muskets and the remains of a sword handle.

Here is the link.

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2012/05/pictures/120531-shipwreck-gulf-mexico-19th-century-nation-science/#/queen-annes-revenge-blackbeard-ship-sword-found_31158_600x450.jpg


Happy hunting,
TreasureGuide@comcast.net

6/3/12 Report - Power Plant Wreck Area

Written by the TreasureGuide for the exclusive use of treasurebeachesreport.blogspot.com.

Here is a construction project going on by the nuclear power plant.  For a while I thought they were going to do this all the way along the dunes there.  Now it looks to me like they are only going to cover the cliff right around the project area.

Note the planted seas oats.  They are protected.

Also note the three foot cut along the bottom of the newly filled and planted area (The picture doesn't show the cut real well.). 

That is pretty high on the beach for a  cut, but the water obviously had been up there.  That area is one area that had cut pretty good a few times in recent months.  I'm sorry they covered it up.  If you put sand where Mother Nature has been moving it, it won't stay very long.

When Mother Nature isn't moving sand, watch for other places where sand is being moved.  If that newly dumped sand originally had anything in it, some of the objects would probably now be at the foot of the cut.  I'm always interested in where sand is moved, no matter if it is by Mother Nature or man.  It can be worth checking.

That is the general area of the Power Plant Wreck and where the small disk shaped silver ingots were found back in the seventies when construction for the power plant was taking place.



Small Silver Ingot From Power Plant Area.



That wreck is thought to be from the late 1500s.  The wreck site is a bit of a mystery.  A lot of miscellaneous artifacts and stories, but not a real coherent picture of what is there.

I've seen old timbers exposed in the dunes north of there when the beach was really cut once.

And an entire stack of Kang Hsi  was found just north of there as well.

Here is an example from the most recent Sedwick Coins auction catalog.  You can see the cross on it. 

These disks were usually small.  This one was just over 32 grams.

Seas are flat today and will remain flat for at least a few days.  We'll be having mostly winds from the west.  It will be a good time to snoop around in the water, but beach finds will be mostly limited to recent drops and chunks of iron near the water's edge, and perhaps some non-metallics.

You might choose to get in the water, although the shallow water is generally very sandy too, or try some off-beach hunting. 


Happy hunting,
TreasureGuide@comcast.net

6/2/12 Report - Emeralds, Reales, Dubloons & Roman Hoard

Written by the TreasureGuide for the exclusive use of treasurebeachesreport.blogspot.com.


Salvage season is heating up.  Last week 58 emeralds were found by Mel Fisher investors at Emerald City.  Some were large too. And on the trail of the Atocha, nine silver coins were found along with iron spikes, pottery and a few encrusted objects.


One thing about treasure hunting is that there is always some place to hunt and something to find.  As conditions change, you have to adapt.  When the conditions are poor for one thing or one type of hunting, they'll be good for something else. 

Here is a really good set of treasure related stories and videos from ABC.  The first is about $500,000 worth of coins found in an auctioned storage unit.  Then there is the story on the guy that finds gold and diamonds on the streets of New York, and then some detectorists in Montana, and a family that specializes in eye-balling lost change.   All good.

Here is the link.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/man-reported-find-500000-worth-treasure-storage-unit/story?id=14958206

Here is a link to a follow-up on the storage locker coins (one article says "dubloons")  and why they were left in an abandoned unit.

http://www.prweb.com/releases/2011/11/prweb8981475.htm

I like the eye-balling piece.  I used to always remind detectorists to keep their eyes open while detecting.  I've known beachcombers who have filled jars with coins and never owned a detector.  

I  wrote a couple of  articles for treasure magazines on eye-balling.  You can actually find things like gold chains, watches and even cobs without a detector. 

Knowing where to look helps a lot.  Check sea weed lines for dollar bills, for example.  Or check the fence lines around parks or fair grounds after windy days.

Very windy days will uncover coins on a dry beach too. 

I also know of one spot in about six feet of water where paper money tends to accumulate in a dip off of one hotel beach.

I've talked about eye-balling in the past and mentioned some of these things before, but it has been quite a while.



Archaeologists found a huge hoard of Roman coins.  The hoard is said to be "the fifth argest UK hoard ever found."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-somerset-17480016

There are almost always some good pieces of information in these stories that you can benefit from thinking about.  This one is no exception.   Always ask yourself why things were found where they were found, and what does that tell you that you can use.

Near the end of the article, it  says, "The find is also unusual as it was discovered by professional archaeologists as opposed to an amateur using a metal detector," he added.

Detectorists deserve a lot of credit for their many contributions.


There isn't much of anything  new to say about the conditions or forecast today.. 

Watch out for the lightening.   I don't mind the rain, but be careful about the lightening.


Happy hunting,
Treasureguide@comcast.net