Written by the TreasureGuide for the exclusive use of treasurebeachesreport.blogspot.com.
Two-Reale Found by Terry S.
Photo by Terry S.
As you might recall, I previously showed and discussed this two-reale that was found by Terry S. Terry had the coin cleaned by West Bay Trading Co. of Vero, who also issued a certificate of authenticity for the coin.
Other Side of Same Two-Reale
Find and photo by Terry S.
Here is the certificate of authenticity.
Certificate of Authenticity for Above Two-Reale
Photo by Terry S.
Terry believes the coin came from an early and previously unknown Treasure Coast shipwreck and is probably the oldest coin ever found on the Treasure Coast. The COA indicates that the wreck is unknown and the coin is graded as grade 1.
Terry also had an eight-reale cleaned and certified by West Bay Trading Company.
Eight-Reale
Find and photo by Terry S.
Here is the other side of the same coin.
Undated Eight-Reale
Find and phot by Terry S.
And here is the COA for the eight-reale.
COA for Eight-Reale Found by Terry S.
Photo by Terry S.
As you can see, the eight-reale is certified as being from the 1715 Fleet and being grade 1.
Thanks for sharing Terry.
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7PM Update: A front came thought this morning and there was some small erosion as early as noon today.
Looks like the surf will be building.
Source: MagicSeaWeed.com
I found a few little things yesterday on a local walk. I haven't taken photos of them yet though.
I also have some other better finds that I'll be looking at.
Written by the TreasureGuide for the exclusive use of treasurebeachesreport.blogspot.com.
Cleaned Early Pillars and Waves Cob Found by Terry S.
Photo by Terry S.
You might remember this find. We saw it before it was cleaned.
Found by Terry S., we wondered if it might be the earliest coin found on the Treasure Coast, and concluded that if not, it was certainly among the earliest. These coins were not dated and even with the assayer mark it is difficult to put a specific date on them.
Terry had West Bay Trading Company clean it for him. We can now see good detail. To the left of the shield is the M for the Mexico mint, and to the right of the shield is the assayer mark, "G."
Here is the other side of the same coin.
Mexico Two-Real After Cleaning
Find and photo by Terry S.
Recently I showed illustrations of other coins from the reign of Juana and Carlos.
On this side of Terry's cob, you can see the two dots between the pillars, indicating that it is a two-reale. This coin looks most similar to type 69 (p. 27) in the Calico, Calico, and Trigo book that I often cite. That book presents 11 varieties (or types) of Juana and Carlos Mexico two-reales, including those marked with assayer's marks of R, G, F, P, A, S, L and O.
Experts agree with what I see in the Calico book and date it to around 1940 - 1948.
Great detail on a very early coin and a great find by Terry S.
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Source: LiveScience.com. See link below.
A towering ponderosa pine discovered in the center of Chaco Canyon in New Mexico, known as the "Plaza Tree," was once thought to symbolize life and the center of the world for an ancient pueblo town. But new research suggests it may have been just a giant log no one bothered to move for 800 years, and maybe didn't hold significant meaning...
For over a hundred years, people assumed the tree had meaning; it was regarded as a "tree of life" according to one researcher, or a "world tree." The solitary tree was once thought to represent the living "center of the world" for the people of Pueblo Bonito, the largest of Chaco Canyon's "great houses," which was occupied between A.D. 850 and 1150. Some speculations placed the tree at the center of a religious cult, and an illustration of a growing "Plaza Tree of Pueblo Bonito" appears in a brochure from the National Park Service...
Eventually fantasy gives way to good sense. "I actually have no idea whether it did, does, or ever had religious significance," Guiterman told Live Science in an email. "I don't know what it was used for, or why it was located in the plaza where it was found."...
That is refreshing. Here is the link for more about that story.
I've mentioned before that when they can't identify the use of an object, archaeologists seem to interpret the object as having some religious significance or being a toy. Its fun to think about things like that, but when you don't know, just say so, or at least make it clear that you are just guessing.
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I took a little walk the other day. Didn't see a single person, so was suitably socially distanced and found this little object. It looks like a bottle stopper, but has "57" on the top.
It is a about the diameter of a half dollar. I think it might be for a Heinz 57 product. I found a photo of one for sale listed as a Heinz 57 bottle stopper, but I don't know the age, product or type of bottle it goes with.
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Yesterday I posted a list of beach closings. William K. sent this addition.
Read your guide today. I live in Indian Harbour Beach and the beaches are not closed here. The access parking lots to the public beaches in Satelite Beach, Melbourne Beach etc. have been barricaded, but you can park nearby and walk to the beach. This past weekend "they" closed the beaches for the weekend only from 11:00-16:00.
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The most entertaining and informative things I saw all week was when Fauci and Birx stumbled around trying to present and explain their graphs/models to the press.
We are very much accustomed to watching the hurricane models every year and are very familiar
with the cone of uncertainty. We know how inexact (wrong) the models can be, and the meteorologists and public has learned the huge cost, psychological/social and otherwise, that can result.
The equivalent of the cone of uncertainty on the epidemiological model that they presented ( I think it is referred to as the Imperial model) was huge. Nobody pointed that out.
They didn't bring those models and graphs back to the last briefing. I'd be surprised if we see them again. They raised more questions in the briefing than they answered. It forced them to defend the unproven assumptions and arbitrariness of the model they selected. Birx admitted to the public their model was skewed by the abundance of New York data, which is the most extreme and atypical case. Admitting that the data is skewed wasn't the bad thing. The bad thing was that they did not make clear why they chose what appears to be one of the most extreme models and they did not explain their assumptions and the degree of uncertainty involved. Nonetheless, their stumbling attempt to present it all to the public was a good thing. I'm sure they will learn from it, as we all have learned from the hurricane models we watch every year.
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I very much enjoy epistemology and studying models and looking data, and the assumptions and levels of uncertainty. It is very much the same in meteorology and epidemiology. Investigating the underlying processes is the fun of it to me. It is the same with treasure hunting. It is about problem solving and creativity. At the center of it all are the same philosophical and psychological questions.
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The other day I mentioned something like, asking Dr. Fauci if he would need more data would be like asking a car salesman if you should buy a new car. But there is one time a car salesman will not say you should buy a new car. … When he is selling used cars.
--- It looks like the surf predictions for Sunday will be a foot or so smaller than previously predicted. Happy hunting (whether it is in the search for knowledge or objects - same thing), TreasureGuide@comcast.net
Written by the TreasureGuide for the exclusive use of treasurebeachesereport.blogspot.com.
Early Mexico Four-Reale Displayed by McLarty Museum.
Submitted by JamminJack.
Not long ago I did a post on some of the oldest coins found on the Treasure Coast. The one shown above is from the period of Juana and Carlos. It is a Mexico minted four-reale.
Monedas Espanolas Desde Juana y Carlos a Isabel II: 1503 a 1868 by Calico, Calico and Trigo, 1985, shows a lot of early coins from both old world and new world mints.
See if you can tell the denomination of the one shown below..
Three Reale Shown in Calico et al Book.
Look between the two pillars above the banner and letters that run across the middle of the pillars. Do you see three dots? That is the denomination. Yes, it is a three-reale!
Cobs, Pieces of Eight and Treasure Coins by Sewall Menzel shows an illustration of the designs on a a three-reale. Here it is.
Three-reale as shown in Menzel book, Cobs, Pieces of Eight and Treasure Coins.
This next one isn't real clear, but I think you can see the two dots between the caps of the pillars. It is a two-reale.
Two-Reale Shown in Calico et al Book.
Menzel also presents an illustration for that type of coin.
Carlos y Juana Three-Three Reale as Shown in Menzel Book.
Similarly, the one-reale has a single dot between the pillars. I won't bother to show that one.
Both the one and two-reale, as well as the three reales shown above were minted in Mexico.
Unfortunately coinage of this period was not dated so it is nearly impossible to determine the date, or even the order of the coins.
The Calico book contains many examples and variations even a ten-reale from an old world mint.
--- The crew of the USS Stickleback didn’t expect things to end this way—rising from the depths on May 28, 1958, only to be broadsided by the hull of a friendly American destroyer, the USS Silverstein. The Stickleback sank to the bottom, an 11,000-foot journey to nowhere.
Now, 62 years since the sub disappeared from any radar screen—and became one of only four U.S. Navy submarines lost since the end of World War II—it’s been found again...
So, if this headline is correct, and as far as I've been able to find, it is, then more people got killed by the flu in one week in 2018 than have been killed in the U. S. so far this year by the current Coronavirus.
Dr. Fauci, in the March 26 New England Journal of Medicine, gives a much less dramatic estimate of Covid-19 than he has been giving on TV lately, suggesting that it might not be much different than the normal flu.
CBS admitted the image they used to show an overcrowded U. S. hostpical was actually an Italian hospital. I'm not saying that U. S. hospitals aren't crowded. They usually are during flu season, but the media can be deceptive.
In another report I saw that the CDC said that up to 15 times more people die of the flu than is reported on death certificates. Health statistics can be very unreliable. You have to look at the details.
You always have to ask questions. I once said that the question is more important than the answer, which seems like a stupid thing to say, but the question is important. Asking the right questions is critically important, no matter whether you are talking about something like metal detecting or epidemiology.
I'm surprised by the high degree of compliance of the American people so far. They've been conditioned by a deluge of threats ranging from the danger of riding a bicycle without a helmet and pads to the threat of monster plastic up to the apocalyptic threat of the climate killing us all. Americans and citizens of the world have been drowned in a sea of experts and bad reporting and have surrendered their independence to those who are thought to know better. An informed involved public is necessary.
I'm very suspicious of what is going on here. It is time for a whole lot of good questions. Not the type of questions that the media is asking, but penetrating questions that will put this whole thing in a meaningful context, resolve doubt and confusion and lead to good practical decisions.
Ask the hard questions. Hold your officials accountable. They aren't losing their jobs and businesses. ---
The Treasure Coast surf will begin to build Saturday night. We are supposed to have some good high surf on Sunday.
Written by the TreasureGuide for the exclusive use of treasurebeachesreport.blogspot.com.
Possibly Oldest Coin Ever Found On The Treasure Coast
Find and photo by Terry S.
I've been reporting and documenting Treasure Coast treasure hunting history, especially beach metal detecting, for several years now. That wasn't my plan when I started this blog, but that is one thing that I've done. As such, it has been my privilege to report many interesting finds and the stories of those who search the beaches. Today I present the story of what is a possibly a record-breaking find made by Terry S. Terry S. just made the find shown above and has been trying to figure out exactly what it is. Below is what he said.
Well folks I finally found a coin that is better than anything I have ever hoped for. This coin was probably lost on the treasure coast beaches 200 years before the 1715 Spanish Plate fleet disaster. This coin was around when Leonardo da Vinci was painting and his work was later to become so famous. It is what most including me would say is the find of a lifetime.
When I found this coin at first I didn’t know for sure what it was, I thought it might be a Spanish reale because I could just make out what appeared to be the Spanish shield on one side. I called Jerry and together we thought it may be a reale but again we both were not sure. That evening Jerry called me and asked what it weighed. It was 6.5 grams and Jerry has a 4 reale that weighs 13 grams... making it a two reale.
I sent several pictures of the coin to a friend that is a real expert and he emailed me back saying that it looks as though it is an Old World coin minted in Spain and asked me to bring the coin over. Now it’s getting interesting and more than a little exciting.
Jean and I took the coin over and my friend spent a lot of time studying the coin and had several reference books as well as an article about some Spanish history dating to the mid 1550’s that he brought up on his computer and asked me to read. I asked him if this coin would date before the 1715 coins being recovered, and he said before that. I then asked if he thought it may date to the 1600’s and again he said before that. At that point I knew I really had something good. A couple days ago I received an email from him saying the coin appears to be a Carlos & Juana 1504 – 1516 silver coin. But I can’t say more until it’s cleaned.
I have had the coin soaking in distilled water, but last night my curiosity got the better of me and used the method where you cover the coin with saliva and wrap it in tin foil holding it until it gets warm then rub it with baking soda. It started to clean up but then I realized that I was being foolish and quit, this coin needs to be taken to an expert for cleaning and I shouldn’t be messing with it. This would be the front of the coin and it’s much more incrusted than the reverse...
It is going to be interesting to see if any coins this age or older have ever been found on Treasure Coast beaches... To a senior citizen with a metal detector this is exciting.
At the top of the post is the coin after Terry removed a little of the dirt. Below are two more views from before any dirt removal.
Two Views of Same Coin Found by Terry S.
I looked through one of my books and found a coin that looks similar. The similar ones I found are Carlos and Juana coins minted in Mexico prior to 1516.
Isn't interesting that just the other day I listed a number of 16th century Treasure Coast shipwrecks and then this early coin is found. Of course even if the coin is 16th century, that doesn't mean it was lost that early. We don't know if it was or not.
I sent Terry the a copy of a page (shown below) from the book, Monedas Espanolas Desde Juana y Carlos a Isabel II 1504 a 1868, by Faran Calico, Xavier Calico y Joaquin Trigo, 6th edition, Barcelona, 1985. That page seems to show coins very similar to the one found by Terry.
On the right side (top to bottom) of Terry's coin I think I could see part of what would be "Charolus." And on the left (bottom to top) a bit of "IOHANA."
The other side, I presume, would have large pillars in the center as shown on the coins in the book.
Quite a find!
Congratulations Terry!
I do recall seeing one very old maravedi that was found on the Treasure Coast, but unfortunately at this time don't recall its age.
Is this the oldest coin ever found on the Treasure Coast? Let me know if you know of any older.
I'll look into it too.
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This has been a good winter for Treasure Coast treasure hunting.
The surf today will be 3 - 5 feet, increasing up to 7 - 11 feet Monday.
Written by the TreasureGuide for the exclusive use of treasurebeachesreport.blogspot.com.
Finds and Photo by Robert H.
Here are some finds by Robert H., who says you should be sure to research your finds. An item like the silver ring shown here would scrap for a few dollars, but Robert found that the German-made Hermes ring retails for $910. That makes it worth doing the research.
Watch for collector pieces. Silver itemsmade by certain designers can be valuable. Vintage costume jewelry can be worth more than you might think too.
A lot of the time, jewelry found on a beach will not be in good condition, and that can dramatically decrease the value.
Silver Hermes Ring Found By Robert.
Photo by Robert H.
Neat Small Watch Found by Robert.
Photo by Robert H.
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I reported on Warren Dennison finding a lost wedding ring and being able to return it to the owner.
That story appeared on WESH TV.
A new Florida magazine has also inquired about the story.
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The floor bidding will begin on Thursday for the upcoming Sedwick Coin auction. The auction features a variety of heart-shaped cobs and royals.
One of the hearts with the lowest listed beginning bid already has online bids of over three time the low starting bid. Here is the item description.
Lima, Peru, cob 2 reales Royal, 1732N, cut into Heart shape, very rare. S-L21; KM-unl. (cf. R32); CT-unl. 5.28 grams. Choice full pillars and cross in true medallic alignment, rather accurately Heart-shaped but cut that way post-minting (note the low weight), with holes at top and bottom of cross, beautifully toned AXF, interesting pedigree to a small collection of (genuine) Hearts sold together in 1985. Pedigreed to the Coin Galleries (Stack's) auction of July 1985 (lot #1123).
]
Sedwick Coins Auction Lot No. 581.
Source of photo: online auction catalog.
Here is the link to that section of the auction, which you can view online.
Written by the TreasureGuide for the exclusive use of treasurebeachesreport.blogspot.com.
A two-reale and two one-reales.
Found on the Treasure Coast.
I went out this morning and was disappointed by what I saw. Despite the strong north wind yesterday the water didn't get up high enough to wash away any sand. Very disappointing.
There were two area where there were signals on the beach, but they were signals from thin pieces of old aluminum. One area was with the sea weed below the old partially refilled cut and the other was down by the water with the buried shells.
I always recommend digging junk targets. One good reason is to remove them, but another good reason is to get an idea of where all kinds of things are located, and at the same time you can develop a mental map of the beach profile.
It is not insignificant to find out where targets such as aluminum have been deposited. That is part of the picture.
The wind was coming so hard from the North yesterday I was really hoping for better beach conditions than what I saw, but I only saw one beach so maybe I missed the good spot for the day.
From what I can tell, it hasn't happened yet (as of this morning).
The wind has changed and is now coming in almost directly from the East. I'm starting to think we won't have any improvement in beach conditions at least until the cold front comes through.
I'm definitely not going to upgrade my beach conditions rating yet. I'm stuck on a 2 for now, and that is a low 2.
I need to look around at some other beaches when I find time.
One reader sent in photos of these reales that he found last Thursday. The one that shows the cross in the photo very clearly appears to be a Mexican minted cob. They are all 1715 Fleet cobs.
The same person also recovered an olive jar shard encrusted with an iron object, a small ballast stone, and two pieces of lead hull patches with canvas markings present. Maybe we'll get to see some photos of them too.
Really nice finds! Thanks much for sharing.
The blog poll is progressing nicely. It is always nice to know what people have found. It helps put it all into perspective. What your chances are, etc. It also helps me validate my beach conditions ratings.
When I find get a better idea of how many items were found I get an idea if my rating might have been too low, too high or right on. That helps me be more accurate with my ratings. I think it will be interesting to compare the number of finds this month to the number found back after Sandy.
Thanks for participating in the poll.
It seems to me that the biggest treasure is perhaps a grateful soul.
I've heard it said that the happiest person is the person who is content with least.
Anthropologists from USF were denied a permit to exhume and study the remains of boys buried at the Dozier School for Boys. The case illustrates and interesting conflict in ethics or lack of same.
